Large Scale Central

East Broad Top Coach #12

Here, after more than a year, is my East Broad Top coach #12. A fairly drastic modification of the Accucraft Jackson & Sharp Fn3 coach.

The prototype was acquired by EBT from the Au Sable & Northern - in fact, Kevin found a couple of photos of it while in operation there.

In WWII, the Navy in Hawaii needed some 3’ gauge equipment to move men and machinery around Honolulu, so they went shopping, and from the EBT they bought 4 coaches. After the war the equipment has all declared surplus and it was scrapped. In 1947, some railroad fans happened upon the scrap line and took a few photos, which were published in the Friends of EBT magazine, Timber Transfer. This photo turned out to be the best photo of coach #12 that we found. Even though the author of the piece was unable to identify it, the curved ends and window frames give it away.

Coach #12 is 44’ long, some 3’ approx longer than an Accucraft Jackson & Sharp coach (“J&S”). It has 14 windows, whereas the J&S has only 12 and a toilet compartment wall. It just happened that I had an old J&S coach side lying on the bench, from an earlier conversion, and also some frame and roof pieces from EBT Baggage #29, which had to be shortened to scale length. The latter coach was a board-and-batten type, as was coach #20, so I had some idea what it would take to make a model from the J&S with lots of added styrene.

So I figured, why not cut off the blank and add 2 windows from the old coach side? No reason, and finally, last summer, I got started. I stripped down the new coach and fed it through the table saw, along with the old side.

Here’s the sides under construction.

The coach is board-and-batten, without the vertical siding that the J&S exhibits. In addition, it has those curves on the upper window frame, so I had Alan Friedland at Great American Locomotion cut me some new frames in 0.5mm styrene.

This is a test of the new window frame. Alan and I debated the radius of the curve - he wanted it bigger, and I think he was right. From any distance, you can hardly see the curve.

I made a small jig that fits over the battens around the window and to hold the battens in place while the glue dries. A strip of 0.5mm black styrene covers the old vertical siding, and smaller strips fit between the windows. A long strip covers the top windows to make the letterboard. Small bits of styrene were necessary to fill the gap at the top of the window under the letterboard.

The frame was cut with the gaps in different locations. Most of the frame is a U-section so you can slip a strip of plastic in the U and glue it to set the frame to the new length. I attached the reworked sides back to the ends using the original J&S screws and tabs (one of which was still intact on each end,) and fiddled with the frame until it fit inside the ends + sides.

After gluing, I extended the tie rods (with brass tube and rod,) and relocated the queen posts to a sensible location, slightly further apart than it used to be. The tie rods needed judicious re-bending. A sheet of aluminum was cut to replace the old steel floor which was now too short. ( I find the steel floor is overkill - the brass trucks add quite enough weight.)

Speaking of trucks, before I even started the body, I removed the trucks and, as usual, drilled out the axle boxes for some small ball bearings, removed the plastic body supporter, and smoothed down the bolster so the truck would let the body sit much lower than before.

Here’s the completed frame after painting with flat black primer. There’s a 9V battery in the middle, held on with a brass strap, that feeds the interior lights through a new push-button switch. I later added another light to the roof array, as the length extension made it seem necessary. The couplers are Accu 1/32nd scale versions, to match the EBT 3/4 size couplers.

The ends had similar battens added, and a couple of windows cut into the end.

The cut-off top of the end is to facilitate conversion to a removable roof. I prefer to solidly glue the sides and ends to the frame, so a means of getting inside in an emergency is needed. [Like when you accidentally push a window in and have to take off the roof to re-glue it in place!]

Here’s the end from the inside, with two square tubes screwed and glued to the end, and a couple of countersunk screws bolting the top piece to the end. Not pretty, but functional and difficult to spot once the roof is in place.

Having painted the sides and ends and adding the dry transfer lettering, I glued the frame and bodywork together.

The curved roof ends were interesting. I looked around the bench and found a Philadelphia Cheese pot lid was about the right curve, so I made a jig to help me draw the curve.

After cutting it approximately to the curve (with the table saw) I sanded it own and took off the remaining lip inside, plus I sanded the end of the roof to flatten it a little. Then I glued a strip of styrene under the end so it would wrap around the curved corners. (I should have waited - the strip got in the way of the rest of the roof processes, as it projected below the roof. It would have been better to do it last.) You can also see the small length of dowel that I use to fill the hole where the chimney used to fit. This coach seems to have no roof appendages at all.

Anyway, back to the table saw and I cut the roof sides and clerestorey at different points. The pieces of roof left over from the baggage were 1.25" long, and this coach is 1.75 longer, so there was still a gap. The two halves of the roof were held together by long (6") strips of 1/4" square tube glued into the underside. [After removing any paint - difficult to do on these coaches. Accucraft must use bullet-proof or temperature-proof stuff.]

The extra 1/2" was filled with layers of thin styrene and sanded down to match the profile. The windows in the clerestory were re-framed with small bits of styrene where the cut had been made. Fortunately this coach had a different configuration of windows and vents at the center, so I was able to place two vents side by side. The photos didn’t give me any details of what the ventilators looked like, so I used some 1/4" styrene and sanded down the corners. The molded grills were painted flat black to represent windows covered with screens. The vents went in the actual window openings, with a small strip holding them in place.

(You can also see the two covered holes where countersunk screws hold the tops of the ends to the roof. Putty was used to fill them.)

The roof was covered using Kevin’s method, with aluminum duct tape. The trick is to draw some lines on the roof at the right spacing, so you can overlap each layer. Rubbing the tape with a wooden stick makes it flatten down.

And that was it. A bit of masking to let me paint the clerestory sides green and the roof black. Any inconsistencies in the roof tape are prototypical (that’s my story and I’m sticking to it.)

The photos were take after I had thoroughly covered the whole coach with a layer of 50% dark grey acrylic paint. It takes the shine off and makes the whole thing look very dull and old.

Very nice. Glad to hear you’re sticking to your tape story.

Nice looking car Pete, thanks for sharing

Kewl!!

Thanks, Pete!

Looks great! A little fuel to the fire to get going on my Coach #13. I like how the rounded ends turned out. I’ve got the ends on mine rounded, but don’t have the trim on it yet. Glad to see an example in the flesh.

Later,

K

Hi Pete

Nice build, car looks great. Thanks for sharing

Chuck

Nice!

I love the cream cheese jig!

Nice job, as usual.

Very nice as usual. The trick of 50% gray is something I need to remember.

I simulate that 50% gray effect by standing well back at the extreme range of a rattle can and using Krylon’s Camaflage medium gray, and then just holding my breath and firing for effect. The trick is to determine what is the maximum range for that can, as it seems to be different for each rattle can.

Notice, this is maximum range, not maximum EFFECTIVE range. There is a difference. You only want a tiny bit of the gray to hit the target.

Nicely done Pete. The detailed build pics are a lot of help.

Beautiful car Pete. I love your paint finish too.

OK Pete,

Good suggestion to move here. For those wondering why an old thread is being brought back to life is that Pete is going to guide me through turning the Accucraft coach into a Brill 14 window coach which looks very similar to the one built here.

Thanks Pete (and Kevin) for offering suggestions on how to get this done.

My first concern is I am not going to buy two coaches to make one. That would be way out of my budget. You used donor parts from other cars but I would assume (and I think you suggested) that the new sides could be cut for me with patterns already available or could be drawn? How thick are the car sides? I am seriously considering a Silhouette Cameo which will cut steyrene. Either way cutting them myself or having them cut seems like a better alternative than buying 4 cars to make two. After purchasing two coaches it seems having the sides cut would be my next biggest challenge. The roof I think could be done the way you did the 1/2 gap left over when you added the section. Maybe in a couple sections so as to get the clerestory windows right? Everything else seems fairly straight forward.

OK. On to the Brill 14-window coach for Devon.

Devon Sinsley said:

Pete and Kevin,

I appreciate all your help in making this decision. Glad we had the conversation and I didn’t start the Carter build. Though they would be fun to build but I want as close to a Brill coach as I can get and knowing that the Accucraft coach is the best starting point I with round up two of them.

Pete,

Now you have already done the 14 window conversion for the Brill. What is involved in that process. How does one go about getting new sides and is there anything else special I will need to pick up? I will need to get on these if i want to have them done by September which is my goal.

Devon,

Take a look at the rest of the thread. As you can see, (first construction pic) I used all the existing side parts from the coach, and a strip from another coach gave me two more windows each side (easier than cutting out one window and adding one.)

So the first thing is to find you an old Accu coach side with at least 4 windows intact. I may have some in MD (I am in FL today) but I sold all my spare sides to a gent in PA. Geoff may have a spare if I can’t find some bits. Or you could advertise in the ‘Wanted’ section for one side.

If you decide to make the planked version, that’s even easier - no battens needed. The frame is easy, and so is the roof. I have a small table saw (Micromark) that cuts these things square, but a hand saw will work as most of the joints are covered afterwards…

No thanks to your keen eye it will have to be a board and batten side. I am not in to big a rush as it will take me some time to gather up two coaches. I would need a total of 8 extra window. If I am going to do one coach I have to do them both. If someone has an extra side that would be great. If not how hard do you think it would be to build the two window section that is needed?

Devon Sinsley said:

No thanks to your keen eye it will have to be a board and batten side. I am not in to big a rush as it will take me some time to gather up two coaches. I would need a total of 8 extra window. If I am going to do one coach I have to do them both. If someone has an extra side that would be great. If not how hard do you think it would be to build the two window section that is needed?

It’s just a slog with various bits of styrene. A real side will make it much easier - I’ll check with Geoff.

Since I was just barely a lurker when this thread originally appeared I figure I’ll comment now.

Nice work Pete! I’ve always admired your EBT equipment, and it’s doubly nice that you guys do all the head scratching and I can just copy. Now that I have #12 and a few hoppers rolling, I’m definitely wanting some coaches and combines. Should be some time this winter to work on them.

Thanks for stirring the kettle Devon, Looking forward to seeing the work on yours.

Randy,

Mine will be a ways off. I do have an end goal. There is a photo of my prototype (Coeur d’Alene Railway & Navigation Co.) that has its #3 locomotive and tender, two box cars, a converted box car caboose, and two Brill coaches. I want to have them done (at least static) by September 2016 for a static display for the 2016 Northern Pacific Convention. I have the loco and tender very close to done, one box car done, and the caboose started. That leaves one box car and these coaches. Pete’s build here is a very close to what the Brill looks like. So with Pete’s and Kevin’s advice I am looking forward to getting these done.

Don’t forget your Mik’s Challenge Priority! (http://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-wink.gif)

Then you can start your dallies with these diversions…

Yer bud,

John