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  • Topic: Tyco 10 wheeler

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    • April 17, 2020 11:38 AM EDT
      • Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
         
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      The headlight top (cap), rear driver, and smoke-box front came from another basket case 10 wheeler. That one had also been broken, and the previous owner used generous amounts of tube glue to repair it. With the blobs of glue oozed down the outside of the boiler, that shell is trashed. But, with a purchase price of a few dollars, it was a good source of the odd bits that I needed to rescue this one.

       

      I haven't decided yet what number to put onto this one. I am thinking of 66, because the 1966 Tyco catalog is the oldest Tyco catalog I have seen that lists the 10 wheeler.

       

      As for a road name, I was going to letter it for the Union Pacific, so it can be assigned to my Union Pacific Roundhouse Sierra cars, but maybe it would be better to not put any road name on it, so it can fill whatever duty I want. The theme of my modules is a railroad museum, but I don't even want to put the museum name on the thing. Why not? Because I don't think "Ferroequine Historiology Cynosure" would fit well onto the thing.

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      Shannon car Shops
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    • April 19, 2020 10:20 AM EDT
      • Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
         
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      Well, I am still undecided on how to letter my latest rebuild. Originally it was going to be lettered for the Union Pacific. Right now I am still considering if I want to do that. But, she can't sit in limbo forever, I have other projects to do. So...

      One of the issues I have had with these things is keeping the boiler back-head in place. At one of the shows I had a momentary flash of brilliance. OK, maybe not brilliance, but I had a good idea. Since the back-head slides onto the back of the open frame motor, and the magnets are at the back of the open frame motor, then why not make the plastic boiler back head magnetic? Then it will stay in place. So I took some #4 washers and glued them to the inside of the boiler back-heads. Now the motor magnets will hold the boiler back-heads in place.

       

       

      Now that that issue is resolved, I attached the tender frame and locomotive with the draw-bar and wired up the DCC decoder, along with the LED driver.

       

       

      I am getting neater with my installs, my first few Tyco installs look awful.

       

      I coloured the wires that go from the locomotive to the tender with a Sharpie, that way I don't have multicoloured wires exposed. I think it looks better with them black.

       

      Then I snapped on the tender shell, and tucked in the wires.

       

      Then I put the top on the tender.

       

      Since she needs a number, so I can program the decoder and know what number I programmed into her, I put a dry transfer number 7 on the back of the tender. I chose 7 since she is the 7th Tyco/Mantua steamer I have reworked and put a decoder into.

       

       

      While working on this locomotive, and Devoning the Hooterville Cannonball, I also got another Mantua locomotive upgraded with new motor magnets, a replacement rear driver, LED headlight, and DCC decoder install.

      If I ever get the roundhouse built, I will be able to populate it now.

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      Shannon car Shops
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    • April 19, 2020 7:44 PM EDT
      • Missouri, It's like Floodsburg, man
         
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      David Maynard said:

      Well, I am still undecided on how to letter my latest rebuild. Originally it was going to be lettered for the Union Pacific. Right now I am still considering if I want to do that.

       If I ever get the roundhouse built, I will be able to populate it now.

      Well, one way to deal with that is to model a movie effects crew getting ready to paint the tender with the name the script calls for, after the museum rented the loco to them for the filming.

      (which in the end merely moves the considering from adding a roadname to how to model the movie crew doing the job)

      That magnet thing was a good idea. Yes, the black wires are an improvement; they get lost in the shadows as well as allude to the water and air brake plumbing between loco and tender.

    • April 20, 2020 7:37 AM EDT
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      A movie crew? Have you been reading my mind again? On my modules, I have a small siding next to where the train station will be The plan is for me to put a red dog parking lot there, with a film crew, some actors, and park the Hooterville Cannonball there. Also, since this is museum theme, I also plan on having a work crew on the other side of the modules, painting some rolling stock.

       

      Thanks Forrest.

       

      Gluing the washer into the boiler back-head seams to work rather well. Some of my better ideas are simple ones.

       

      Yes, my idea with colouring the wires black was to mimic the water and air lines.

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      Shannon car Shops
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    • April 20, 2020 8:02 AM EDT
      • Missouri, It's like Floodsburg, man
         
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      Speaking of the Hooterville Cannonball, and museums, and movies, and I've probably told about this, at least once, on here somewhere before, the same fellow, Richard C. Datin, who built the original models for the original Star Trek TV show also built miniatures of the train and the Shady Rest Motel for the Petticoat junction TV show. That is covered on pages 106 to 112 of book "The Enterprise NCC 1701 and The Model Maker" by N. Datin McDonald and Richard C. Datin, Jr. Dick Datin was also involved in getting the Nevada State Railroad Museum set up and open.

      Locomotive model was used for several scenes, among them a homecoming where it snapped a banner across the track.
      Datin wanted to build model at 1/12 scale but cost led to smaller scale of 7/16 = 1 ft.
      Model was used to keep from having to pay to going up to the real one's location for filming.

      Book says producers had a full size mockup locomotive, they got secondhand, of a somehwat different configuration than the prototype at Jamestown, CA.

      Page 111 has photo of Datin taking photo of the model on a bench out in a grassy lot.

      Photos of the real 4-6-0 on page 109 show the Tyco/Mantua model to most likely be patterned on it.

      Page 107 has photo of model of Shady Rest Motel.

       

      This post was edited by Forrest Scott Wood at April 20, 2020 8:15 AM EDT
    • April 20, 2020 10:36 AM EDT
      • Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
         
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      Interesting. I knew about the wood 1:1 model they used for filming, but I didn't know about the smaller model. In fact, in the credits of the TV show, the producers thank the hotel that owned the wood 1:1 model.

       

      Yes, the Tyco model is based on Sierra number 3, but its in a slightly larger scale than HO. The cast in number plate on the boiler front even has the number 3 cast into it.

       

      Last night I ran the thing on my test track.

       

      Odd thing is when I ran it anti-clockwise, it would stall in the curves. Running it clockwise there were no issues. I discovered that the lead wheel on the lead (pony) truck, would rub against the metal tab of the replacement brass pilot. Since none of the curves on the club's set ups are supposed to be as tight as my test track, I probably didn't need to worry about it. But I still filed back the edges of that tab so that the lead wheels no longer rubbed against it. Also, somewhere along the line, I lost the headlight lens. After running it for about a half an hour, it ran nice and smooth. She just needed to get some exercise to work out some of the stiffness in her parts.

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      Shannon car Shops
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    • April 20, 2020 10:41 AM EDT
      • Missouri, It's like Floodsburg, man
         
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      David Maynard said:

      Yes, the Tyco model is based on Sierra number 3, but its in a slightly larger scale than HO. last night I ran the thing on my test track.

      Wonder if that might be OO's 4mm/foot, 1/76 scale, instead of HO's 3.5mm/foot, 1/87 point something usually ignored, scale?

      Sounds like the test counts as successful.

    • April 20, 2020 9:12 PM EDT
      • Smoggy L.A., Left Coast
         
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      I got one of these, don't think I will ever do anything with it, interested?

       

      http://tycotrain.tripod.com/steamengines/id14.html

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    • April 20, 2020 9:23 PM EDT
      • Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
         
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      I have heard various scales listed, but 1:76 sounds about right. Yea Ho is like 1:87.1, the .1 doesn't contribute much, so its usually ignored.

       

      Yea, the test was successful. So now I have a couple more in the works. I wanted to get my AHM/Rivarrossi and Bachmann 4-4-0s up and running, but replacing the motors needs a bit more engineering then I want to devote at this time.

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      Shannon car Shops
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    • April 25, 2020 8:44 AM EDT
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      Vic Smith said:

      I got one of these, don't think I will ever do anything with it, interested?

       

      http://tycotrain.tripod.com/steamengines/id14.html

      Yes Vic. I am interested. PM me and maybe we can work something out.

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      Shannon car Shops
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    • April 25, 2020 8:45 PM EDT
      • Fleetwood , PA
         
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      I often wondered about putting decoders in my penn line steam engines. Never thought about replacing the magnet at the back of the motor. Most of those use much heavier pitman motors. I believe they are DC71 motors. They run so smooth to begin with but I thought the addition of a dcc decoder would be fun.

    • April 26, 2020 7:11 AM EDT
      • Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
         
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      Well, the open frame motors in the Tyco/Mantua locomotives do benefit from replacing the magnets. Replacing the magnets reduces the current draw, and improves the low speed performance of the motors.

       

      Several "experts" have said that DCC decoders cannot be used on the old open frame motors, supposedly because those motors draw too much current. I haven't had any issues with my economy Digitrax decoders with these open frame motors.

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      Shannon car Shops
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    • May 7, 2020 4:43 PM EDT
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      I was sidetracked with some yard work, I got the outdoor railroad's pond up and running for the year. I cut down all the dead plant stalks in the upper pond, A.K.A. marsh. I also dug out some of the peat from the upper pond, so, hopefully, it won't overflow as quickly. I also talked to a surveyor, I need my land surveyed, so I can get a permit, so I can put up a fence, to try and keep out the hoofed forest rats (deer).

       

      Also I have been fighting with decals on the tender one of my 10 wheelers. It took several applications of Micro Set to eliminate the silvering in the decals. The decals are old, very old, and they don't want to play nice. Then I clear coated the tender. The clear coat caused the base paint to crinkle. I guess I can't use Krylon clear coat over Krylon red.

       

      Anyway, one of the latest 10 wheelers I got up and running was originally a 12 wheeler (4-8-0)

       

      I wanted the 12 wheeler drive for another project. So I took a 10 wheeler chassis, filed the odd extra feature off the pilot, painted the wheel centers, pilot and steam chest Krylon gloss navy blue. The steam chest on the original 12 wheeler was silver, but it was all chipped and scratched. I didn't like the look of the silver steam chest, so I went with blue. The Krylon navy blue is a very close match for the blue that Tyco/Mantua used on the cab and tender. As with all my my 10 wheelers, I replaced the motor magnet, the rear driver (to eliminate the traction ring), replaced the headlight bulb with a yellow LED, and upgraded to DCC.

       

      This is the other one i finished (to this point).

       

      Now I have 2 black 10 wheelers (one gloss and this one that is flat) that I need to letter with  road names and numbers. I am sure I will come up with an idea for the road names eventually.

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      Shannon car Shops
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    • May 18, 2020 7:47 PM EDT
      • Missouri, It's like Floodsburg, man
         
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      Since we're talking Tyco rehabs, a question:

      While going through my boxed-up On30 projects Thursday and Friday I came across a Tyco pseudo-GG1-1 acquired somewhere in recent years. It was bought knowing it was complete but did not run.
      Took a break from my long dormant On30 project revival (one is on a Tyco/Mantua 4-wheel Plymouth mechanism) to dismantle the G and try to troubleshoot it.

      First problem is that whatever grease whoever applied who knows when has pretty much "grease-glued" the transmission.

      The effort required to remove and free the axles was exponentially more than reasonable.
      Was deeply concerned about breaking gear teeth but that seems to have not happened.

      I know things can be done about that on these, and even on full size internal combustion vehicles, but do not know what it is which can be done to this.


      What I do know is that scratch below on engineer window is really deep and will need filler.
      So, I might as well dunk the body in Scalecoat's "Wash Away" to strip all the paint.
      And if I'm going to do that, might as well add some pilot details and LED headlights ...

      ... IF ...

      ... the motor and transmission can be restored.

      So -->

      --> I am requesting advice on how to dissolve, loosen, clean, the "grease glue" wihtout damaging the lacquer insulation on the armature windings.

       

       

    • May 18, 2020 8:05 PM EDT
      • Not one of the WannaBe's,
         
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      I'd soak in dawn. it don't hurt wild life

    • May 19, 2020 5:28 AM EDT
      • Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
         
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      I haven't taken mine apart, so I don't know if the motor can be separated from the gears to soak the gears. The grease in the old Tycos can usually be cleaned off with Dawn dish-soap in water and a toothbrush.

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      Shannon car Shops
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    • May 19, 2020 7:04 AM EDT
      • Not one of the WannaBe's,
         
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      All can be separated Dave, but soaking the armature will not hurt thing you just need to let it sit for a week or so, preferably after you blow dry it with an air gun, before you plug it in. Again YMMV

    • May 19, 2020 5:56 PM EDT
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      David, that may be true. I just have an aversion to getting motors wet. Its a personal preference, or maybe a personality flaw, of mine.

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      Shannon car Shops
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    • May 19, 2020 6:40 PM EDT
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      Yep it goes against what was taught back in the day, but if that were the case think of all the dropped electronics devises that would be trash if not for a day or two in a bag of rice

    • June 28, 2020 11:24 AM EDT
      • Kokomo, Indiana
         
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      If you camp out on ebay, Mantua in the last days of operation started putting can motors in this style of motor set up.  They can be found with the angled mount and correct worm gear on the shaft from time to time.  I have one of the bumblebee DRG 12 wheelers.  Same boiler/cab/tender as the ten wheeler.  They are OO scale in physical size so the motor would fit in the cab.  These and the General 4-4-0 are about the only options out there if you want to model the pre 1900 era of railroading in the USA.  Sadly, no mfg's have paid attention to this era to give us a much better running model, outside of the new generation of Bachmann's 4-4-0 with a tiny pager motor in the boiler instead of the early tender drives.   Another option is the Rivarossi/AHM Casey Jones 4-6-0(vastly improved with a NWSL speed reduction regear kit), or their tender driven 4-4-0's.  But then you deal with deep flanges from those early models.    Great work on the Tyco/Mantua 4-6-0.   You do NOT have to isolate the whole motor from the frame, just BOTH motor brushes.  A piece of insulation stripped from some wire can be slid over the spring wire for the grounded motor brush, isolating it from the motor/locomotive's frame.  Then you can wire for DCC after doing the magnet job.  A new can motor obviously is the best option and they run sooooo much better with one.      Mike

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