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  • Topic: Recent Marklin/LGB Chinese production

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    • August 5, 2010 10:19 PM EDT

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      This morning I took delivery of two Durango & Silverton cars, made in China in late 2009, purchased new from a retailer. I can now categorically state that I am cured of my obsession with purchasing recently produced LGB cars. In simple terms - complete rubbish. Gone are the days of engineering plastics. Today's product has no sheen, is very rubbery in texture and is along the lines of the quality one expects from that other knockoff brandname manufacturer. A little birdie told me that the products come from the same factory!

      The body has a rubbery feel/texture to it. The trussrods and endrailings feel like rubber bands and were permanently distorted, new in the box, as received. Did I say that these are rubbish. Bitterly disappointed with the quality. I purchased two original D&S German made coaches, some weeks ago and thought to make up a train. There will be no more newly sourced cars coming my way! How can the company market this trash??????
    • August 6, 2010 6:50 AM EDT
      • Shut up Rooster
         
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      and the sad part is they probabley cost more now then in the past. I got the forney a few months back and it also is made in China. The engine is a great runner some say it is a little lighter but comparable to the older ones thank god. I also noticed the side rods are plastic not metal. How much more effort is it for a company to put metal ones on. Thats why I prefere to make my own rolling stock or kitbash new ones.
    • August 6, 2010 8:22 AM EDT

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      Shawn,
      the Chinese produced items from approximately six to seven years ago, including the re-released Rio Grande Forney #251 of 2005 (not the current #252) were almost the equal of the earlier German items, with similar finish and attention to detail. The two coaches that I received today remind me of toys one would find in a $2.00 shop. They have a very toy like quality about them.

      The Pennsy Forney that you purchased, was made prior to the Marklin acquisition in 2007/8 and would thus be a well made item. It differs from the original German made item in having two traction tyres to compensate for the lack of adhesive weight, due health and safety concerns over the use of lead in toys.
    • August 6, 2010 9:59 AM EDT

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      Tim - are there visible differences that a side by side photo might reveal (hint) to those of us who have not yet purchased a newly-made LGB item?
    • August 6, 2010 6:40 PM EDT

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      Al.
      I have numerous Chinese made coaches from around six/seven years ago and apart from the Made in China stamp, one would not be the wiser to their heritage. Today's product is vastly different. As soon as the item is viewed, the most startling standouts are the washed out colour (very pale yellow on the D&S cars) and the plastic has the appearance of a child's soft plastic toy truck with a very matte rubbery look/feel to it. The additional parts, like the trussrods, are floppy rubbery mouldings and the end railings are very, very flexible and rubbery in texture. The cars actually look to be raw plastic colour and unpainted, enabling a see-through appearance as one sees on the cheap knockoffs from the other company (or is it the same company?).
    • August 9, 2010 12:44 AM EDT

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      Tim-
      Thanks for the analysis.
      Okay, the "other company" is Bachmann? Am I accurate that Kader is making LGB (Marklin) large scale products and also Bachmann?
      Secondly, is it an accurate conclusion that ALL of the catalogued LGB products are coming from this "X" mfg. company? Is this company's production to Marklin's specs? Perhaps that question is a stretch. If the answer were to be yes, we now know more of who is running Marklin's quality control.

      Thanks for your insights.
      Wendell
    • August 9, 2010 1:24 AM EDT

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      Just a clarification: Kader owns Bachmann. Bachmann does not make anything, Kader does. Bachmann sells stuff. This is just like Aristo, no Aristo employee makes anything, used to be Sanda Kan, but Kader bought them too.

      Greg
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    • August 9, 2010 2:13 AM EDT

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      Wendell,
      the 'other company' is Newqida. I have unconfirmed reports that the company that manufactures Newqida, also produces the Marklin/LGB Chinese production (nothing to do with Bachmann, I would think). No more recent production LGB for me (back to evilbay for my German made purchases).
    • August 10, 2010 3:12 PM EDT
      • Cumming, GA
         
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      Ah you see the light for this new LGB stuff. When production stoped in Germany so did the quality. Later RJD
    • August 10, 2010 3:58 PM EDT
      • Smoggy L.A., Left Coast
         
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      Tim Brien said:
      Wendell, the 'other company' is Newqida. I have unconfirmed reports that the company that manufactures Newqida, also produces the Marklin/LGB Chinese production .
      Well, that would certainly explain alot wouldnt it....
      ____________________________________
      Have fun with your trains
    • September 15, 2010 3:09 AM EDT

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      Victor Smith said:
      Tim Brien said:
      Wendell, the 'other company' is Newqida. I have unconfirmed reports that the company that manufactures Newqida, also produces the Marklin/LGB Chinese production .
      Well, that would certainly explain alot wouldnt it....
      Then again, unconfirmed reports are just that. Unconfirmed, and that in my eyes makes them not reports, but rumors. So you heard unconfirmed rumors that the Chinese LGB factory also make and market the "other brand". That is possible, but.. unconfirmed is 'beyond a reasonable doubt' to me, atleast with the frenzy of fiction stated as facts in the last years with regards to LGB, then Märklin bancrupcy and then with NQD/Amax. The conclusion seems to be though that the 'other brand' is priced right in terms of quality, while the 'original brand' now sells 'the other brand' quality for 'the original brand' price or even more... Is that a correct conclusion?
    • September 15, 2010 5:41 PM EDT
      • Anaheim, CA and Bayfield, CO,
         
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      Tim,

      Very interesting on the rubber like feel and appearance. Good to know.

      If I needed some cars I likely would have purchased them sight unseen expecting similar quality to the Chinese made late era LGB products. Very interesting to note the big drop off in quality and appearance. With what you got it would have been appropriate if there was also a big drop in price...which of course didn't happen.

      Thanks again for the info as I likely would have wasted money on new LGB stuff expecting similar quality. Of course not German made quality, but still up to what they made shortly before closing down.

      I remember comparing some of the then new LGB (made in China) D&RGW coaches to my very old (made in West Germany) D&RGW coaches oh maybe in 2001. They were very similar in feel, but the newer coaches color was a little off and the trucks on the new ones were more gray then black. But other then that they both looked fine in a trainset together. Glad to know the latest cars will likely never go nicely with the older stuff.


      If it isn't too much trouble, I'd love to see a photo of these new cars next to your older ones.
      ____________________________________

      Click Here for photos of my train layouts

    • September 15, 2010 5:58 PM EDT

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      Matt,
      I will attempt a photo in a day or so, but I do not believe the photo would show the differences. My main gripes are the washed out colour, apparently plastic impregnated and not painted and the trussrods and end railings are a very flimsy, flexible rubber and appear permanently distorted. The doors on the baggage car are unpainted see-through, much like the Newqida mouldings. You are better off picking up older, as new models on eBay. I paid $95.00 USD each, which is about the top price level one would pay for an original German produced D&S car on eBay.
    • September 15, 2010 7:02 PM EDT
      • Smoggy L.A., Left Coast
         
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      Matt said:
      Tim, Very interesting on the rubber like feel and appearance. Good to know.
      One possible bright spot to that for guys like me, if the train ever derailed and fell off the layout, they may not crash so much as...bounce! :lol:
      ____________________________________
      Have fun with your trains
    • February 22, 2011 8:27 PM EST
      • Juniata Falls, Pennsylvania
         
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      Great, thanks for the depressing news guys. I'd had every intention of buying the new centerflow hopper that is being touted. Guess that just went out the window.... perhaps scrap the UP side off an old one and replace with the B&O sides from the new one.... maybe.
    • March 21, 2011 12:35 PM EDT

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      I only just noticed this thread .
      My experience could not be more different . The LGB stuff I have bought has no obvious drop in standards .
      And while I think of it , the Piko stuff is OK too .
      Why can we not stop knocking these companies ? Is it that they are not made in the USA ? Let's not get into silly arguments again , they do nothing for the hobby , and are no credit to those who make exaggerated claims of crappy models .
      Or I may get just as silly and start listing the Bachmann and other stuff from the USA that I have junked .
      Look on the bright side and try to enjoy life through someone else's enjoyment .
    • March 21, 2011 4:47 PM EDT
      • UK/Ontario/Oregon
         
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      Mike, if you still have my e-mail address, please give me a call. I have something to show you that I think will meet with your approval.

      If you do not have it, please PM me.

      Best

      tac
    • March 21, 2011 5:16 PM EDT

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      Tac , I have just sent an email via the site .
      cheers
      Mike
    • March 21, 2011 10:54 PM EDT

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      I'm puzzled. Mike states, above, he purchased LGB stuff "that has no obvious drop in standards." He is credible and certainly made an accurate assessment.

      However, some questions: Were those products purchased under the Marklin regime? Recently manufactured -- say, in the last ten months? The evidence of quality changes cited earlier in this thread were comparisions of rolling stock stated to be manufactured during the Marklin regime in comparison to non-Marklin production.

      ANALYSIS:
      So why the discussion starting with the first posting? My analysis is the initial postings were to determine if LGB, the historical masthead of quality in the hobby, had depreciated. If so, the discussion centered, only in part, on the significance of that depreciation to our hobby. Hobby leaders are the respected ones. Those leaders shape both the status and the nature of the hobby itself. LGB mfg. DEFINITELY has held high status since their "invention" of the product in the late 60s. So now what? Who is leading the hobby? Is either Lewis Polk, Charlie and his son, or the owner of TRAINWORLD the leader? Will LGB be sold again to a corporate logo or visionary who wants the hobby to be a household word -- again, as did LGB, Inc., so aptly achieve? For years, LGB WAS the hobby. They developed the vocabulary, the image, and the marketing standards for the hobby.

      CONCLUSION:
      I see every caution given by Mike as to not to "bash" anyone. That is still good advice to all of us. Yet, to discuss and explore the status of an apparently perceived falled leader is worthwhile. IF not "fallen" what did happen or what IS happening? All of those questions are worthy of our concern.

      Wendell
    • March 22, 2011 4:43 PM EDT

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      Wendell , your closing paragraph hit the proverbial nail . Thanks for your support .
      Of course we must criticise where necessary , but not use a wrecking ball to do it .
      The latest LGB item I got was the Bernina Anniversary Set , it came out around Christmas . I got it because I liked it , and was not disappointed when we got it home and unpacked it . (My supplier shows a display model and gives you an unopened box , if you so desire)
      I must confess that I did not look to see where it was made , but the 4 items in the set did not seem any different than the separately boxed items of the same models I already had ----in quality that is .
      The Driving unit was different in that it had a Bow Pickup rather than the Diamond one .
      I also got the new print version of the containers in Co-op colours ; surprisingly , it has been claimed that these are discontinued . Another way of knocking a product ?
      I have not seen mention here of Trainline 45 ; I think you may see it under the Train-li banner at a rather higher price than we pay here .
      The track and rolling stock are at least the equal of LGB (that crappy then ?) , and the prices here compare favourably with LGB . They are apparently made in Germany under the auspices of a model shop---who give a rapid turnround on orders , and a discount on three or more coaches .
      So , this side of the ocean , things are quite nice , thanks .

      Mike
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