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    • March 4, 2013 12:54 PM EST
      • N.E. , oHIo
         
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      I'm doing an install of a revo and the parts I have don't entirely match the parts pictured in the manual.

      My question is about the adaptor plug. The one shown is a simple 12 pin reciever board with solder pads but the one I have has 2 fuses and wire leads on it. The revo is part #57002 no sound. I'm curious what the fuses are for? Anyone know for sure?

      Thanks

      Terry

    • March 4, 2013 1:47 PM EST

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      Terry Burr said:

      I'm doing an install of a revo and the parts I have don't entirely match the parts pictured in the manual.

      My question is about the adaptor plug. The one shown is a simple 12 pin reciever board with solder pads but the one I have has 2 fuses and wire leads on it. The revo is part #57002 no sound. I'm curious what the fuses are for? Anyone know for sure?

      Thanks

      Terry

      Terry - the fuses are just protection and will blow if the output is shorted.  They are on the two leads that go to the motor.  Here is a link to a photo of three different versions of what you describe - I believe the one you have is in the left.

       

       

      dave

    • March 4, 2013 2:45 PM EST

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      Terry, be sure to support the other end so vibration does not fatigue the 12 pin end that is in the socket.

       

      Greg

      ____________________________________

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    • March 4, 2013 3:38 PM EST
      • N.E. , oHIo
         
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      Thanks for the input. Yes mine is on the left. By traceing the wires that's what I assumed was motor protection. My other thought was maybe for battery operation but they didn't look like they offered complete protection for the reciever.

    • March 5, 2013 12:04 PM EST

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      Dave, do you have the Aristo part numbers to match the sockets in your picture... the Aristo online shopping system only shows parts that are in stock, and no pictures.

       

      I'll post this info in my site to help others too...

       

      Thanks, Greg

      ____________________________________

      Be sure­ to visit ­my site, l­ots of tec­hnical tip­s and modi­fications,­ and you c­an search ­for topics­ and key w­ords.


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      PLEASE NOT­E: Clearly­ not every­one likes ­my contrib­utions, ev­en if fact­ual. So, i­f you have­ a questio­n, feel fr­ee to emai­l me priva­tely. This­ way I won­'t be "bashing" or "bully­ing".­ I'm still­ out here ­to help, u­se regular­ email onl­y: greg@el­massian.co­m

    • March 6, 2013 5:43 AM EST

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      Sorry, Greg- I do not have them at the moment - I escaped the snowstorm that was scheduled to hit Pittsburgh and arrived in Florida last night for a week of bike riding (will also attend the big car show on Amelia Island this weekend - get to see the 2014 'Vette!)

       

      I'll check when we get home.

       

      dave

    • March 9, 2013 11:12 PM EST
      • Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
         
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      Greg, I don’t think Aristo-Craft assigned stock numbers to the adapter boards that came with the Revolution receivers.

       

      The original adapter board with 7 wires and no fuses was labeled UEXT-01.

       

      The following version with 7 wires and fuses, like Dave shows top left, is labeled UEXT-02 (v1.1).

       

      The new version of the adapter board that comes with the Revolution receiver with sounds has screw terminal blocks. It is labeled "PNP PCB". Unfortunately the screw terminals made by www.degson.com will only hold one wire.

       

       

      Bachmann uses these as well on their PnP circuit board. They are not as solid as the Phoenix Contact terminal blocks.

       

      The other two boards that Dave showed are Plug and Play Boards. The earlier one, top right in Dave’s picture, is CRE57077.

       

      The newer version with the heavy diodes and capacitors, bottom right in Dave’s picture, is CRE57078.

       

       

      The input (AC-TRACK) and output (MOTOR) screw terminals on both PnP Boards will hold two wires. They also have a header for the rear pins of a receiver or decoder.

      This post was edited by Paul Norton at March 9, 2013 11:13 PM EST
    • March 10, 2013 1:44 PM EDT

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      Thank you so much for the detailed replies gentlemen!

       

      Paul, what is the reason for the 100 ohm resistors to the sound board?

       

      Thanks again,

       

      Greg

       

      p.s. pretty weird to fuse the motor, seems to me that the decoder itself should be fused.

      This post was edited by Greg Elmassian at March 10, 2013 1:54 PM EDT
      ____________________________________

      Be sure­ to visit ­my site, l­ots of tec­hnical tip­s and modi­fications,­ and you c­an search ­for topics­ and key w­ords.


      ­Click HERE for Greg­'s web sit­e
      PLEASE NOT­E: Clearly­ not every­one likes ­my contrib­utions, ev­en if fact­ual. So, i­f you have­ a questio­n, feel fr­ee to emai­l me priva­tely. This­ way I won­'t be "bashing" or "bully­ing".­ I'm still­ out here ­to help, u­se regular­ email onl­y: greg@el­massian.co­m

    • March 11, 2013 1:20 AM EDT
      • Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
         
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      Hi Greg!

       

      Phoenix Sound recommends adding the resistors to the motor speed (voltage) sensing wires if other than the 3.6 volt battery supplied for track power is used to power the 2K2. In this installation a 14.8 volt lithium-ion battery pack was used.

       

      Every sound board has its own special requirements. The PB9 has diodes in the motor speed (voltage) sensing wires.

       

      I guess A-C feels that a derailment using full track power is the most likely cause of a short.

       

      In this installation I installed polyfuses to protect the receiver and sound board from the battery pack since the PnP Board does not.

       

    • March 11, 2013 1:51 AM EDT

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      Paul, where did you read about the resistors or diodes on the motor inputs? Did they mention any particular reason for them? I ask because I've got a few Phoenix/Revo installations where the directional whistles are sometimes squirrely, and/or the Johnson bar effect gets weirded out with voltage changes. Both boards in these examples are P8s.

       

      Later,

       

      K

    • March 11, 2013 4:35 AM EDT

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      kevin,

       a few notes about P8 boards. I burned up a brand new Mallet with one of these boards installed with the Revo board. They were designed to operate at about 22 volts max. Their current limiting device is the full bridge rectifier. Thus they suggest a resettable thermal resistor be placed in line with the track voltage as often power supplies go to 25 volts or higher. Similarly, the resistors from the motor to reduce voltages to less than 12volts for the electronic relay for best operation. Also they note that their sound output often burns out the speakers in the Aristro and Bachmann engines at full power. They suggest replacing them with speakers that have larger wattage.

       

      Phoenix has the best sound fidelity going. But there are a few quirks that need to be addressed during installation.

       

    • March 11, 2013 9:36 PM EDT
      • Off the Grid
         
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      Kevin Strong said:

      Paul, where did you read about the resistors or diodes on the motor inputs? Did they mention any particular reason for them? I ask because I've got a few Phoenix/Revo installations where the directional whistles are sometimes squirrely, and/or the Johnson bar effect gets weirded out with voltage changes. Both boards in these examples are P8s.

      Later,

      K

      I've got a '97 powered by 14.8 that blows forward regardless. Might give the resistors a try. I think I put them in my trail car with the 2K2 and it blows fine.

      This post was edited by Daktah John at March 11, 2013 9:37 PM EDT
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    • March 12, 2013 1:10 AM EDT
      • Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
         
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      The wiring diagram in the 2K2 Manual on the Phoenix Sound web site shows the resistors.

       

      http://www.phoenixsound.com/pdf/2k2Handbook.pdf

       

      The Knowledgebase Section is also full of useful information on the different boards and installations.

       

      http://kb.phoenixsound.com/

       

      I always check both when someone asks me to install something I am not familiar with.

    • March 12, 2013 1:33 AM EDT
      • Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
         
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      If the directional whistles are not in sync with the motors, exchanging the orange and gray motor speed (voltage) sensing wires usually sort things out.

       

      The other thing that plays havoc with the all the sounds from a stop is the start speed setting on the Revolution throttle. If it set to 10% or higher, a lot of these sounds get skipped or mushed together.

       

      We had problems with the sound file chosen for Stu’s Connie. Air pump 1 would puff lightly twice and shut off no matter how we programmed it. So we shut it off and tried air pump 2. It made a lot of racket and would not stop. We shut it off and went back to air pump 1.

       

      His Connie also had an erratic chuff at low speed. It turns out it was voltage driven because we had not selected the terminal for the Bachmann chuff mechanism.

       

      There are so many choices in the PS Programming screens it is easy to miss something.

       

      I did stumble on something that I liked. I had the ALCO sound file at the top of diesel sound page loaded in my FA-1. It just didn’t sound right to me. But when we were looking around we found the PA file on the bottom of the page. It sounded much better and more like the old ALCOs that I have heard. There are two choices of horns built into the file as well.

    • March 12, 2013 2:00 AM EDT

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      Paul, once you have settled on a particular sound with features that you like, do save the config files for using with future installations with that particular sound?
      Also if the toots are directionally incorrect you can reverse the default direction in feature set.
      ____________________________________

      Best wishes,
      Tony Walsham

      Remote Control Systems. www.rcs-rc.com/
        Modern technology. Old Fashioned reliability

    • March 12, 2013 9:41 PM EDT
      • Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
         
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      I am usually alright with the diesel sounds. It’s the other club members with everything from Annies to K27s. Since I have the Phoenix Sound Programmer, they all end up here. But what do I know about steam, it was all gone before I was 12. I spent my leisure time fishing and playing sports, not roaming rail yards.

       

      Although my dad was a Conductor, my fist time on a train was to go trout fishing with him in Algonquin Park. That got to be a regular spring and fall event during my teens. Even then, I was more interested in the park and fishing than trains. But I do remember those trips in the van (caboose).

       

      The fold down beds that were 6 inches shorter than I was and smelled of coal oil, as did everything else in the van including my dad’s leather grip. The wash basin that was so shallow it splashed water every time the van lurched. And with 110 cars ahead of us on winding rails it lurched a lot. Climbing the grab irons up to the cupola to watch for hotboxes, and of course enjoying the park scenery. Watching my dad cook a full course meal in an iron skillet on the pot bellied stove. My dad always said he lived through the golden age of railroading, and I believe him.

       

      Now where was I …. Oh yah, sound boards. Because we do a lot of switching, the first thing that is turned off is any automatic toots, clangs, hisses, screeches, etc. at start-up. Next is the automatic grade crossing signal once a certain speed is reached. Then the whistle/horn and bell are set to manual. We pay a good dollar for a programmable sound board with all the bells and whistles, and then turn most of it off. But it sure does add a lot of realism and enjoyment to any locomotive. :-)

       

      This post was edited by Paul Norton at March 12, 2013 9:44 PM EDT
    • March 20, 2013 7:02 PM EDT

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      "If the directional whistles are not in sync with the motors, exchanging the orange and gray motor speed (voltage) sensing wires usually sort things out."

      Paul, does that cure erratic (inconsistent) behavior, or just always blowing forward when in reverse and vice versa?

       

      Later,

       

      K

      This post was edited by Kevin Strong at March 20, 2013 7:03 PM EDT
    • March 20, 2013 9:26 PM EDT
      • Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
         
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      Hi Kevin!

       

      Exchanging the motor speed (voltage) sensing wires just corrects the directional toots.

       

      Another thing that may cause some inconsistency is the bell hold-off that sets the minimum interval between automatic starting and stopping bell signals.

       

      Similarly the horn/whistle hold-off sets the minimum interval between automatic starting and stopping toots.

       

      There are the settings we should be using to eliminate all the clanging and whistling when we operate, rather than just turning the sound functions off. ;-)

       

      There is also a requirement for a specific difference in speed between grade crossing signals, but I cannot find the reference right now.

       

      It’s time to hit the hay. I have to be ready by 5:30 AM tomorrow for our trip to the ECLSTS. As I am retired, getting up before dawn is something I seldom do. It’s usually the sun light over the neighbours’ rooves that cause me to stir.

       

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